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Chapter 4: Interview
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about ten people seated in the conference room, chatting with their neighbors
on one side or the other. As soon as they realized the prospective pastor had
been escorted into the room, they rose as a body and faced him. It was almost
as though an ensign had barked, "Admiral on deck!" Jim was tempted to
say "At ease."
said simply, "Be seated, folks. I'd like you to meet Jim Hogan from Ashtabula,
Ohio. We're running a little tight on time so let's get started. You all know
that Jim has been given a unanimous vote by the board to come as our next pastor.
Jim, I'm going to turn things over to you. I think we should plan to break up
here about one so we can get ready for the open interview session in Fellowship
Hall, and that begins at one thirty."
took his seat and glanced around the table. Sandy had been at work with her Macintosh
and mouse in here, too. Everyone was wearing the same type of name badge he wore.
In addition, a crisp place card which showed name and title was at each person's
chair . At that moment Sandy appeared at his side and, with a quick wink, deftly
replaced a "Rev. James A. Hogan" card with the "Jim Hogan"
version. Jim promised himself he would learn more about this Macintosh and LaserWriter
business whether he pastored this church or not.
he scanned the names and titles on the place cards which Sandy had prepared: Jason
Masters, Assistant Pastor; Jill Dawson, Associate Pastor for Young Adults; Bob
Baker, Associate Pastor for Teens; Emily Marlow, Associate Pastor for Education;
Cliff Graham, Associate Pastor for Music; Patricia Court, Director of Wesley Day
Care. Besides the professional staff, there were three secretaries present: Betty
Hummel, Lois Boop, and Rebekah Ottinger. Grace Carson, Miles Abbott, and Sandy
Simpson had place cards, also.
continued. "We would like this to be a smaller and more informal version
of the open interview this afternoon. This will give us some time to get to know
each other a little. And please feel free to ask questions. It's all yours, Jim."
morning, everyone," and there were friendly smiles and nods all around with
a chorus of good mornings in return. "Maybe I should have said good noon."
Appreciative laughter from the group.
to my watch, we have about 70 minutes to get acquainted. I have copies of your
job descriptions which Sandy has kindly prepared, and I see each of you has a
copy of my resume abstract. But I'd like to have us exchange some information,
somewhat off the cuff. Agreed?" More nods and smiles.
you provide resume abstracts to go with these job descriptions?" he asked
they're attached to the back of the job descriptions."
Then I guess I have everything I'll need if I need to do some pondering when I
get back home."
caught some raised eyebrows at Sandy's casual use of his first name.
I'd like to share some information about myself which doesn't appear on that resume.
Most important, I know Jesus Christ as my personal Savior. I have accepted Him
as my Lamb of God. I believe God sent Him into the world to die as the ultimate,
supreme, once-and-for all sin sacrifice so I, and anyone else who accepts Him
as their sacrifice, won't have to bear the penalty for sin which is eternal death.
I also have the presence of the Holy Spirit and He provides me with three types
of power. This power to the third power includes power to comprehend the eternal
truths of the Bible and to share those truths with others, power to be preserved
from sin as long I maintain my guard so Satan and his demons can't destroy me,
and third, power to do things which far exceed my own human abilities."
Jim was pleased
to note that his testimony was punctuated at various points by amens, with the
most frequent and fervent coming from Jason Masters.
minute ago, I thought a saw a little reaction when Sandy called me Jim. Sandy,
why don't you comment on that yourself?"
she summarized the incident about the name tag which had taken place in the reception
home, the people on staff are free to call me Jim when we're working together
in the offices, like we are right now. We have a youth pastor, Gary Marker, and
all the kids call him Pastor Gary-- when they're not calling him "Magic Marker"
or "Little Miss Marker. He has a very open relationship with all the kids
and they love him all the more for it. That's the way we like to operate in Ashtabula."
Jim could detect
an easing of tension which seemed to circle the table. Jason took off his jacket
and hung it over the back of his chair. Bob loosened his tie and unbuttoned his
collar. Miles pushed back his chair and propped his feet on the table, getting
a stern visual rebuke from Sandy.
played along. "Glad to see you're getting comfortable. But if you sleep,
appreciative laughter as everyone got psychologically comfortable at least.
your turn to talk. Jason, let's start with you."
you, Jim, for letting me call you 'Jim'". More appreciative laughter.
sure what was so funny but decided to let Jason continue and see what developed.
to Messiah Village to retire after thirty-five years in the ministry. But Grace,
here, Shanghaied me back into active duty. My job as Assistant Pastor has involved
visiting new contacts and those who are ill, running our ministry for senior citizens,
and carrying a fairly heavy load in the area of spiritual counseling. And, when
the Senior Pastor is away or ill, I fill the pulpit."
does it very well, I might add," said Grace. "Jim, before you continue
your meeting, I think I should say what everyone else is thinking. Your personal
style is so different from Dr. Clark's that the staff is close to shock. That's
why everyone has the giggles and Miles has been misbehaving. We're just expressing
a feeling of release. Now don't get me wrong. Dr. Jeremiah Clark is a saint of
God whom we all respect highly. It's just that his wife, who always calls him
'Dr. Clark' when anyone is around, well-- Mable just puts a little too much starch
in his shirts. That's all." Close to uncontrolled laughter. "But now
Dr. Clark has retired to Florida and it looks like we may be entering a new era.
Does that help?"
does. But for now, let's leave Jerry to his fishing pole or golf clubs or whatever
it is that retired people do down in Florida. "Jill, tell me about your work
with the young adults."
Dawson was somewhat rounded but smiled readily and had deep dimples. She talked
rapidly, saying much of it with her hands. Jim's Dad would say this woman could
talk a leg off an iron pot.
ministry includes programs for folks from the day they graduate from high school
up through their late twenties, early thirties. Activities, outings, Bible studies,
personal witnessing and visitation, maybe a little informal career and marriage
counseling thrown in. You name it, we do it," Jill finished with a flourish
of her hands.
like a full-time job. Bob, how about you?
lot of the same programs as Jill has but mine run from the seventh through the
twelfth grades. I spend a lot of time in the high schools, especially during lunch
periods. Just talking with kids, not only our church kids but anyone who wants
to talk. I'm the chaplain of four different varsity football teams; pray with
the guys in the locker rooms before the game, kind of hang out on the bench. The
last weekend of the football season, I attended parts of six games. Two Friday
night, two Saturday afternoon, and two Saturday night. It's a very exciting and
a very rewarding ministry."
nodded approvingly. It was easy to see that this man would be equally at home
in a locker room or a Bible study. Jim guessed Bob Baker stood at least six-six.
His afro was well-trimmed and his dress was stylishly casual but impeccable. His
voice was well-modulated and his speech was both crisp and articulate. Jim had
a hunch he knew a little more about playing football than praying before the game.
let's hear about the Christian education you're giving these kids."
Marlow wore her medium brown hair straight and parted in the middle. Debra would
call her attractive which meant no major structural flaws but not pretty, either.
Behind her round oversized wire rims her eyes flashed with a dry wit and an articulate
summary of her ministry told Jim she might be plain but she surely wasn't dull.
He learned her responsibilities extended beyond the traditional morning Sunday
school hour to include nursery and junior church programs from infancy through
sixth grade. She also ran church-related scouting programs for boys and girls.
During her spare time, she taught classes to train teachers and aids in doctrine
as well as the principles of education. Busy lady.
spoke up, a wide grin on his face. "Jim, I claim the honor of introducing
our Associate Pastor for Music. Meet Cliff Barrows Graham!"
joined in the laughter with Miles laughing loudest.
a name like that, you don't need a title," Jim joked amid the laughter.
were saved at a Billy Graham crusade while my mother was carrying me, and that's
how I got the name. The music comes from the fact that they are both card-carrying
professional musicians to this day."
went on to say that he directed the choir and orchestra, led the singing, and
coordinated special music for all services. In addition, he taught classes in
sight reading music and coached the people who supplied the special music in performance
is an important part of worship," said Jim seriously. "I'm looking forward
to hearing the choir and orchestra tomorrow morning.
let's talk about the wee ones. Ready Patricia?"
the director of the Wesley Day Care outlined her program, explaining that she
used the nursery and classroom facilities of Wesley Evangelical Church to provide
a quality Christ-centered day care program for families of all religious persuasions.
Next Jim asked
the three secretaries to talk a little about their work. He noted that all three
spoke with some degree of the Pennsylvania Dutch accent common to the central
part of the state. Rebekah Ottinger was the most dutchified of all and wore the
small white cap of the Mennonites.
was extremely impressed with the staff. They were all very well spoken and gave
evidence of a sincere concern for the souls of their parishioners. Checking the
resume abstracts as each person spoke, he had noted that everyone had a Master's
degree. Jason, Bob, and Jill had received theirs at various evangelical seminaries.
Emily, Cliff, and Patricia had their degrees in their respective fields.
believe that about wraps things up as far as I'm concerned, except for one thing.
I already know Miles and Sandy are married. How about the rest of you?"
nods around the table. "She isn't married," said Miles looking straight
at Grace, who responded with a warning wag of her finger.
may be out of line in this, and if I am, Grace can cut me off. But I'd like to
include the spouses in the staff banquet you've planned for this evening. This
afternoon's interview sounds like it may get hectic and tomorrow I'll be meeting
hundreds of new people. I'd like to have a relatively quiet time with all of us
at this table plus your spouses. Of course if your spouse has another commitment,
no problem. I know this is spur of the moment.
Grace, I'll make a deal with you. If you can talk the board into supporting this
extra expense, I'll be your escort for the evening!"
laughed approvingly and Miles clapped loudly.
an offer no one of my age or marital status should reject," said Grace with
a broad smile. "It's a deal!"
meeting broke up on that note and Sandy hurried to her phone to instruct the restaurant
to plan for an extra nine places at dinner that evening. Miles and Grace stayed
behind to confer with Jim.
looked at her watch. "The buffet over in Fellowship Hall should be ready
to serve now. Shall I ask Sandy and the girls to bring over trays? We could eat
right here so you wouldn't have to stand in line."
wouldn't mind standing in line if I were going to eat," Jim said quietly.
Actually I was hoping to slip into the sanctuary and spend some time at the altar
between now and when the interview is to start. I'm not worried about knowing
the answers to the questions, but I am concerned that I phrase those answers in
a way which will be informative without being abrasive."
and Miles nodded, silently pleased at the emphasis Jim placed on prayer in his
Jim. Sandy, Miles, and I will get our lunch and I'll plan to meet you back here,
shall we say, around two? My guess is we won't be ready to introduce you until
about that time.
nodded and as he was rising to leave for the sanctuary, Sandy tapped on the open
me, Jim, but I forgot to ask you about editing the tape."
tape is that, Sandy?"
sorry, Jim," Grace said. "I'm the one who forgot. We're planning to
tape the interview this afternoon. You'll be speaking from a mike, of course,
and we're asking each person with a question to come to a mike, also, when they
speak. After the interview, our sound man, Dick Allen, will duplicate the interview
tape and copies will be available in the morning services for anyone who didn't
get to this afternoon's session. Go ahead with your question, Sandy."
needs to know if you want to review the tape or have edits made before he makes
hid his surprise at the plans for taping and duplicating. By noon tomorrow, the
church's entire constituency would have access to every word he said this afternoon.
He was doubly glad that he would be able to spend an hour or so at the altar before
running the gauntlet. "As far as I know now, nothing will need to be done
to the tape before it's duplicated. Barring some type of tasteless outburst from
a questioner, that is. Tell Dick to go ahead with the duplicating unless he hears
from me otherwise."
Miles, and Grace all liked Jim's answer and Sandy hurried out to return Dick's
the very instant Jim was dropping to his knees at the church altar, Debra was
kneeling in prayer in the study at the Ashtabula parsonage. It wasn't until six
months later that they learned of what was far more than a coincidence.
five minutes after two, Grace came hurrying into the conference room, somewhat
out of breath.
think we're about ready for you in Fellowship Hall, Jim. Everyone who bought a
buffet ticket has now gone through the line and if you don't mind talking while
people finish eating, I think we can begin."
do it," Jim said.
estimated that three hundred people were seated at tables in Fellowship Hall and
at least that many were seated in rows of folding chairs along the walls and across
the back. Those in the rows of chairs had either finished eating or had elected
to skip the buffet and just come for the interview. Jim sat in an empty chair
near the entrance as Grace moved to the podium.
for the church board and the search committee, I'd like to thank all of you for
coming out this afternoon to meet Jim Hogan who is a candidate for senior pastor.
Jim, why don't you stand so everyone can see who you are." The candidate
for pastor rose briefly and was greeted with vigorous applause.
case we haven't met, my name is Grace Carson and I chair the church board. On
my right is Miles Abbott who heads the search committee, and he's seated with
his lovely wife, Sandy, who serves as administrative assistant to the senior pastor.
of you may not know the history of what brings Jim Hogan to Mechanicsburg today
so let me fill you in. Back in September, shortly after Dr. Clark retired, Miles
and Sandy and a couple people from the search committee went to hear Jim preach
in his current church at Ashtabula, Ohio. He had no idea who they were then but
they came back with a very glowing report of Jim's preaching and how he conducted
the morning worship service. On the basis of that visit, the board invited Jim
and his wife, Debra, to come and talk to us about moving to Mechanicsburg. He
didn't preach for us at that time but the board was so impressed, we gave Jim
a unanimous call to become our next pastor.
few of you know that our bylaws require that a pastoral call by the board must
be ratified by a two-thirds vote of members who are of voting age and present
at a meeting called at least three weeks in advance. That ratification vote will
be taken tomorrow evening after the service. Before you vote, however, we wanted
you to have an opportunity to present questions to our candidate on any Biblical,
or moral, or social issues-- as long as those questions are in good taste. Jim
readily consented to subject himself to what we have come to refer to among ourselves
as 'the interview'. He's also agreed to not use an open Bible or any notes in
responding to your questions. He has no idea what your questions will be. In fact,
none of us do. This will be entirely extemporaneous.
some guidelines for you. You may ask one primary question and one follow-up question.
You may not ask a third question or engage in any type of dialog with Jim. If
you do, I think Dick Allen over here on the PA system will shut your water off."
Everyone laughed and Grace continued. Now, let's give a warm Mechanicsburg welcome
to Jim Hogan of Ashtabula, Ohio!"
rose and the applause was hearty and prolonged. When the hall was quiet and the
people had resumed their seats, Jim began. "Thank you for that 'warm' welcome.
While driving through a blizzard on I-80 yesterday afternoon, there was a time
when I thought I might never get out of Clearfield County. So anything warm is
really welcome." More laughter. I'm not going to spend any time talking about
myself or my family. Sandy tells me you have a copy of my resume and personal
testimony. Let me assure you that every word of that testimony about my relationship
with God, His Only Begotton Son, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit is absolutely
true. I'm not quite as sure about the resume." Again laughter.
sure are a lot of people here this afternoon and if you each ask just one question,
we'll be here till the snow melts. So here's what I'd like to do. Sandy has some
three-by-five index cards numbered one through ten." Sandy fanned her cards
and held them high for every one to see. "If you want to ask a question,
get Sandy's attention and she'll give you a numbered card. Please don't write
your question on the card. It's just to show you when it's your turn to come to
the mike and ask your question. After the first ten questions have been asked,
we'll recycle the cards and start all over--until all questions have been asked
or until we run out of time. When you get up here to the mike, please begin with
your name and your relationship to this church or another organization you may
questions about asking questions? Yes, right here in front."
question, Pastor", said a very large lady with a very small hat perched on
top of her head. "I just want to get a card so I can have a number."
Sandy, give this lady a card and, Ma'am, please step to the mike and tell us your
name is Betty Lydecker and I'm a charter member of this church. What I want to
know is, which do you think is the real Bible? I keep hearing about these new-fangled
translations and I don't know which one to read any more."
"The King James Version was good enough for Peter and Paul so it's good enough for me." General laughter. "Seriously, Betty, . . . " and the questions and questioners came in a steady steam.
After several rounds of questions and answers, Jim was beginning to feel pretty good about this question and answer business in front of such a large audience. His pleasure was short-lived. The woman stepping to the mike was dressed very sharp, in the casual, loose-fitting style favored by Yuppies. If Jessi was here, she would know instantly what clothing label was being displayed. Was it Ann Taylor, Liz Claiborne, Perry Ellis? Whatever the label, the woman's set jaw and piercing eyes told Jim that his answer would not be welcomed.
broke into Jim's reverie by saying hesitantly, "Pastor Jim, this is Penny
Starr. She's an investigative reporter for 'The Guide'." Jim could hear the
tension in Sandy's voice and wasn't sure what to expect.
like to ask a question as a private citizen instead of a reporter," Ms. Starr
said in a cultured, low-pitched voice which hinted at on-air experience. "Are
you pro-choice or are you pro-life?"
and Debra had talked about how to handle an abortion question if one was asked,
so he knew exactly what he was going to say. Knowing what to say didn't make him
feel any better about saying it because he could tell he was in a lose-lose situation.
forced choice such as you've given me, I must say that I'm pro-life," and
he continued smoothly when she tried to cut in, "but let me put that position
in context. Abortion is one of the most painful and divisive topics on the contemporary
social, legal, and religious scene. I surely can't hope to provide a solution
during this interview. However, I think I can provide some food for thought by
drawing your attention to another controversial topic which has also been much
discussed in social, legal, religious, and political circles, and that is capital
punishment. If you're saying, 'Hey, Pastor, there's no relationship between abortion
and capital punishment, give me the next three minutes and at least listen.
are the points of comparison between abortion and capital punishment. First, both
involve life. Second, both involve ending life for what are thought to be good
reasons. And third, both have strong adherents and opponents. Now let's look at
these one by one, and I'm taking the life issue first. If you believe the Bible,
you have to accept the fact that life begins at conception. The prophet Jeremiah
talks about God calling to him while he was still in his mother's womb. If you're
talking about breath, that does begin at birth, If you're talking about life,
that begins at conception. Of course there is no question that a convicted criminal
let's talk about the 'thought-to-be' good reasons for ending life. In the case
of the unborn fetus, these reasons generally relate to the personal preferences
of the woman, with the dominant preference having a lot to do with convenience.
A career woman finds it inconvenient to interrupt her climb up the corporate ladder
to have a baby. The working woman finds it inconvenient to lose the second income
and incur the financial burden of raising a child. The unmarried woman simply
finds it inconvenient. In other words, the decision to kill the baby is made on
the basis of what the woman wants to do, not on the basis of what the baby has
let's talk about the "thought-to-be" good reasons for ending life in
the case of the person convicted of a terrible crime such as a murder and kidnapping.
First, the Bible clearly supports the concept of capital punishment. God Himself
practiced it regularly and He commanded that it be used by humans in cases of
horrible crimes. In fact, every civilization since the dawn of time has applied
the principles of capital punishment-- until the last 50 years or so. In other
words, the decision to kill the person who commits a horrible crime is based on
what that person has done.
the ultimate point of the comparison. The average liberal supports abortion and
opposes capital punishment while the average conservative opposes abortion and
supports capital punishment. I may not have the research to support this theory
but you can do your own research right now. Think of your liberal and conservative
acquaintances. Where do they stand on these issues?
that, said Jim hoping to defuse a potentially tense situation, is a K-Mart Blue
Light Special-- two for the price of one."
was positive there would be a follow-up question but the reporter just stared
straight into his eyes before reaching up to adjust her floppy-brim hat. That
movement was a signal because at that instant, about fifteen young adults seated
across the back of the hall leaped to their feet and began marching up the center
aisle. As they marched, they pumped convention-style signs up and down on which
had been screen-printed the slogan "It's Our Body" in huge block letters.
As the demonstrators marched, they chanted "It's our body, we decide!"
over and over again. As the marchers neared the front row of seats, the leader
handed an extra sign to Penny Starr who then headed the column, strutting and
shouting at the top of her lungs, "It's our body, we decide! It's our body,
the front of Fellowship Hall was bathed by harsh TV lights. A Channel 27 Action
News minicam had just swung into action. But before the camera man could pan down
the line of marchers, a painful whistle blast stopped everything cold. Dick Allen,
the sound man, jerked off his earphones and yelped in pain.
Carson was standing at the mike, calmly twirling the lanyard of an Acme Thunderer
referee's whistle clockwise and counterclockwise around her index finger, very
much like a bored lifeguard on a stand at Virginia Beach. There was complete silence
for about ten seconds.
Penny again lifted her sign and opened her mouth to continue the chant. Before
she could utter a single syllable, Grace popped the Acme back in her mouth, leaned
close to the mike, and shrilled three short, sharp blasts.
Starr, sit down!" she ordered in her clarion principal's voice. "You
are on private property in a private building by invitation of the official board
of this church. Our right to assemble and our right of free speech supersede anything
you plan to say or do! And the rest of you can take your seats, also. I've had
all of you in school at one time or another and you know I won't stand for this
kind of nonsense."
was totally amazed at what happened next. Later, as he and Debra discussed the
demonstration back in Ashtabula, he still couldn't believe it. Penny Starr lowered
her gaze, her sign, and her feathers, and returned to her seat. The rest of the
demonstrators did the same! Jim was stunned!. Having a retired high school principal
as chair of the church board wasn't all bad.
TV reporter was still hovering along the side wall so Jim decided to outflank
him. "Why don't we take a short break so we can all have a chance to stretch
a little. I'll be ready for the next question at exactly two-forty-five,"
he said as he set his wrist alarm.
the break, Jim made a quick stop in the men's room and then walked down to the
sanctuary altar for ten minutes of intense prayer. "Lord, help me say the
right thing in the right way. May your Holy Spirit touch my mind, touch my lips,
keep my spirit sweet and Christ-like . . ."
a small vestibule off the rear entrance to Fellowship Hall, an impromptu board
meeting was being held during the break. "Well, what do you think?"
Grace asked casually.
impressed," Miles offered promptly. "The guy's dynamite! Glad we're
getting this on tape." Several members nodded agreement but Karl Zimmerman
was giving his close-cropped and grizzled head a knuckle massage.
I'm not so sure," he said in the Snyder County whine of the Pennsylvania
Dutchman. "Some things he's talking about are controversial. And he seems
so sure. Everything is black or white. There's nowhere to think for yourself,
seems to me."
exactly what I like about him," Miles retorted. "Stands on his own two
feet and speaks his mind. If we're going to pay a man a generous salary plus housing
and fringes, I expect to get my money's worth."
tell you one thing," spoke up an elderly lady with a cane hanging from her
arm, "every word he's said so far is straight from the Bible. And he's speaking
without notes and hasn't even opened the Good Book once."
agree with Sister Briscow," spoke up Sandy, "and a lot of the people
out there in the Hall do, too. I don't want a pastor who's so wishy-washy you
can't tell if he's fer it or agin it."
down, little lady," said Miles. "You don't have a vote on the board."
not have a vote but I'll always have an opinion," Sandy flashed back.
that right," Miles muttered good-naturedly and the ad hoc board meeting broke
up as the participants drifted back to their seats in the Hall.
resumed his place at the mike, ready for the questions to continue. Sandy, who
has the next question?"
questioning continued for another forty-five minutes or so and might have gone
on into the night but Grace intervened. "Pastor Jim Hogan, I am positively
amazed at your depth of knowledge on each topic on which you have been questioned.
And I have been moved by the Christian spirit in which you have handled some of
the most controversial issues in our society today. But most important, and I
must give credit to Pastor Jason Mattern for pointing this out to me just a little
while ago, you have been in a spirit of prayer much of the afternoon. In fact,
Pastor Jason told me that he has felt strongly impressed to pray for you as you
presented your answers. And that makes sense, because no mere mortal would be
gifted with your depth of wisdom unless the Holy Spirit was upon him.
we close, I want to remind you that Pastor Jim will be preaching in both worship
services tomorrow morning as well as tomorrow night. And remember that this session
was taped this afternoon and if you ordered a tape ahead of time, you can pick
up that tape after the services tomorrow morning at the information desk in the
one last announcement. Tomorrow evening at the close of the worship service, the
church will vote on whether to call James Hogan to be our next pastor. All church
members fifteen years of age and older will be eligible to vote. Anyone have anything
else before we close?" and Grace visually checked with Sandy, Miles, and
key board members. "All right, Pastor Jim, I'll call upon you for closing
remarks-- as long as you promise not to answer any more questions!" The crowd
said, "Let us stand for prayer. . ."
the brief prayer, a man approached Jim with a smile and hand extended. "My
name is Ray Benson and I was wondering if you've ever thought of doing any TV?"
Some ministers may feel called to the electronic pulpit but I have never felt
drawn in that direction.
about Christian radio?"
have thought about that, especially a music format. We evangelicals tell our kids
not to listen to secular rock music because of its emphasis on sex and drugs and
violence, and even the occult. But what do we offer in its place? I feel the church
should put its money where its convictions-- and restriction-- are. We should
financially support Christian music on the radio. And not only in contemporary
formats for the kids, but in easy-listening and southern formats for the rest
of us, too."
about a Christian talk show with live phone calls? You sure know how to handle
gave it a thought," Jim said honestly. "Maybe some day." Benson
handed Jim his card and then turned to go.
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